Our guest is Nisha Kanabar. Nisha Kanabar is a curator and storyteller, and the founder of Industrie Africa. A Tanzanian of Indian origin, Kanabar graduated from Parsons School of Design in New York, and went on to forge a career in luxury fashion and publishing. With over a decade of experience at renowned industry names, she held formative positions at American Vogue, Vogue India and Style.com in the Middle East. Her experience across international markets fuel the desire to channel her work into her home continent's contemporary and luxury designer market with a special focus on diversity. She currently resides in Dar es Salaam Tanzania, whilst her work regularly takes her across the continent and around the world. About the host: Fadel Jaoui, an economist, started this podcast to celebrate African entrepreneurial success stories, to hear the originals and changemakers behind them, and to draw lessons to inspire many more stories across the continent. This virtuous cycle is fundamental to pool talent and investments, and ultimately create startup “unicorns” that would benefit Africa’s prosperity. Fadel is a strong advocate of entrepreneurial ecosystem building and private sector development as true engines of sustainable economic growth. And he is a firm believer in leveraging innovation and technology to leapfrog development constraints and scale up social and economic impact. He holds a Ph.D. in Economics from Oxford University, as well as degrees from Columbia University and the London School of Economics. He started his career in investment banking in London, and has held various positions in International Financial Institutions (views are his own).
Fadel Jaoui:
Hi, everyone. Our guest today is Nisha Kanabar. Nisha Kanabar is a curator and storyteller, and the founder of Industrie Africa. A Tanzanian of Indian origin, Kanabar graduated from Parsons School of Design in New York, and went on to forge a career in luxury fashion and publishing. With over a decade of experience at renowned industry names, she held formative positions at American Vogue, Vogue India and Style.com in the Middle East. Her experience across international markets fuel the desire to channel her work into her home continent's contemporary and luxury designer market with a special focus on diversity. She currently resides in Dar es Salaam Tanzania, whilst her work regularly takes her across the continent and around the world. Nisha, welcome to the show, and I'm delighted to have you today.
Nisha Kanabar:
Thank you so much, Fadel. I'm very happy to be here. I've been listening to your podcast for a while so it's an honor to turn the voice on myself, I suppose.
Fadel Jaoui:
Much appreciated, much appreciated, Nisha. Let's get it started, and let's go back to the very beginning, at the ideation stage. How did the epiphany of starting Industrie Africa come about, and what inspired you?
Nisha Kanabar:
Sure. Just a few years ago, and as recently as a few years ago, accessing this sort of accurate contemporary picture of regional fashion, especially beyond dominant markets like Nigeria and South Africa, was quite challenging. In a nutshell, I would say the fashion story of Africa was under represented. It was totally un-Google-able, it was reduced to media bias, and quite frankly, stereotypes. Industrie Africa launched as a platform in July of 2018, a platform that really offered access to the African fashion landscape in a new, in an accurate and really intuitive way for the global fashion fraternity. We mean buyers, media, press, student, the industry at large. It was an industry focused resource that I launched as an experiment. We launched content prior to launching the website iteration, and saw this abnormal amount of engagement and volume in such a short span of time.
Nisha Kanabar:
It became this go-to stop for the latest in African fashion, whether it was news, new brands to follow, events that were happening, related trailblazers. When we launched we had that similar response from international media as we were addressing something that I suppose was a major gap in the market. Those two years since launch were crucial for us. We tapped into an incredible following of smart, engaged African fashion enthusiasts. We saw an overwhelming demand for consumer product and African-led content, beyond just the industry. I think what really set us apart is we were speaking as a voice of our community. We represented African fashion interests to the world, to a global audience, through this clean editorial framework that was very new, I think, at the time. These observations led to the relaunch of the platform in now July of 2020 last year, in a much greater way.
Fadel Jaoui:
Okay, so initially the audience, your initial target audience, was it international from the get go? Or the regional audience? How did you think about it at the very beginning?
Nisha Kanabar:
Quite frankly it was both, because Africa at the time, and I think still to an extent, is quite fractured. Though we paint with broad strokes when it comes to the continent, we each have our own unique dialect, our own unique cultures, our own unique governments, frameworks, languages, policies. Trade is also something that's a huge barrier for us. When it comes to shopping local, that wasn't something that was ingrained in the consumer on the continent either. It was always the person who wanted to shop luxury or shop fashion had to shop outside of the continent. Or at least have the mentality to shop outside of the continent. For me, it was about educating the regional consumer to shop local, as well as the international consumer to turn their attention to what was happening on the continent.
Fadel Jaoui:
I like when you use the word educating because it looks like there is a real need of educating because it looks like there is a real need of educating the customer, international and local, about the made in Africa brand. It's non-trivial. I guess that's part of the work that you have to do.
Nisha Kanabar:
Absolutely, absolutely. I think made in Africa is such a huge story. I think there's something to be said when it comes to changing the perception of what people perceive made in Africa to be. To be more synonymous with the craftsmanship that we should be associated with, with the quality that we should be associated with.
Fadel Jaoui:
I agree with you. How about the name? Industrie Africa. It has that French, I want to call it ‘je ne sais quoi’, which I find quite elegant, I must say. How did you and your co-founder come up with the name?
Nisha Kanabar:
I wish there was some grand story I could tell behind the inception of the name but unfortunately-
Fadel Jaoui:
You should invent it. You should invent the story.
Nisha Kanabar:
I think after this call I'm certainly going to go think about the backstory a little bit.
Fadel Jaoui:
Yeah, a narrative.
Nisha Kanabar:
Exactly. We launched the name, quite honestly, before really knowing what the platform was going to be. Like I said, it launched as an informational resource. What I did know is that I wanted to create a brand identity that was community focused, and that was versatile, and that felt elegant and elevated as you have said. But also felt broad enough to encompass these different verticals that we may go into.
Fadel Jaoui:
Okay. Let's go back a bit more, to talk about yourself. You had a great career working with top industry names. We mentioned that earlier. The likes of Vogue, Condé Nast, Saint Laurent, which is a bit more predictable and relatively lower risk path. What was a trigger that made you decide to make the jump from being a professional to becoming an entrepreneur?
Nisha Kanabar:
That's a great question. Why the path of most resistance? What I guess makes my journey less cookie cutter than the average fashion professional is my pivot towards, and passion toward the emerging world. The emerging markets in general, very early in my publishing career. I will say that Vogue India was super formative for me in that sense. It was my first experience with a dynamic, burgeoning raw industry that had so many moving parts. I was quite fascinated with being a part of that growth, and quite fascinated also by the unique narrative that we were able to own within an international context. That was the budding thoughts for me, behind how I ended up going into this space. But that, along with my position at Style.com in the Middle East in Dubai, really taught me the role of media in driving a markets' infrastructure. But also its power as a cultural and aesthetic ambassador. I felt like there was a major gap when it came to the continent in that sense.
Nisha Kanabar:
The dots really connected very cleanly for me. To be honest, I love my country. I love my continent. I want to see us thrive, and so it was about seeing how I could lend my experience to that conversation. One of my greatest strengths, and most defining strengths I will say, and I thought it was something that was ubiquitous but I'm actually starting to realize that not a lot of people are able to cultivate, and perhaps it's the one that most definitively shapes my approach as an entrepreneur, is that I have a certain skill for problem solving through design. It's something that actually I honed at Parsons. This, combined with my formal knowledge of the industry through my experience, of course, was really all it took because our industries on the continent are really quite riddled with gaps. That's no surprise. Always opportunities to improve, to leapfrog systems that maybe took a little longer in the West to develop.
Nisha Kanabar:
I can quite frankly say that you don't really know what to expect prior to going into this founder mode. You don't really know what to expect when you're an entrepreneur. I dove in head first, I took a big leap of passion, I would say, more than faith. And ended up here. As far as my family is, I guess we're all hustlers in our own rights. My dad is self made. He has no formal education. He had a really tough, tough childhood, to be quite honest with you. But what he did is give us the platform to be able to follow our dreams our possibilities. My dad, I'm very proud of, of course. My brother is now topping Forbes Africa list, so I guess to an extent you can say that we have an entrepreneurial background, but not a traditional one.
Fadel Jaoui:
Looks like I need to interview your brother as well.
Nisha Kanabar:
Sure, yes. He'd be delighted.
Fadel Jaoui:
He should be next. Back to the company, because you mentioned that you re-designed the platform in June 2020. Tell us more about the company as it is today.
Nisha Kanabar:
Sure. Without rambling too much, in a nutshell I can say that we are a multidimensional retail and community destination that really allows you to discover, to explore, to shop AKA access, and really immerse yourself in the world of high-end and contemporary African fashion. But in a way that is intuitive to you, that speaks to you, and is done through this lens of storytelling. We work very closely with our designers to deliver straight from their studios to our customers' doors, through DHL Express. That is the model that we've adopted. But the mission largely remains the same, if not more emphasized. In fact, it is twofold. One is to continue to challenge these stereotypical constructs of what people perceive African fashion to be. It was this box of traditional prints or ceremonial garb. Two is to harness authentic pan-African voices and trailblazers, through a global fashion lens or voice, catering to a fashion loving audience, which as I mentioned earlier, is new to the continent. I'll say, what we're doing is really celebrating this multitude of African identities, all 54 of them is what we aim for.
Nisha Kanabar:
This multitude of cultures, of design nuances in a single framework. I believe it's important to tell these modern day sartorial stories, each of which are uniquely luxurious, expressive, intimate and finally accessible thanks to us, through the familiarity of a very trusted shopping experience. What I like to tell people is it's African fashion meets your favorite fashion content destination, meets your favorite luxury platform. That is Industrie Africa and that is what you should expect from us. We are more than just a retail destination, we are an ecosystem. There are three drivers of success to the ecosystem. There is commerce, there is content, and there is community. Breaking those down a little further, commerce represents this unprecedented access to the landscape, that offers people the ability to interact with product at their fingertips, within a matter of days.
Nisha Kanabar:
Content is represented by the authentic storytelling. When you're talking about African fashion, and contributing to this really important large conversation, thoughtful commentary and context is everything. African fashion is storied and unique in its own way so people do not click that checkout button in a vacuum. I think authentic storytelling is very important. Commanding the conversation with that editorial language and focus is also very important, and it serves as a contextualizer for what we do. Then thirdly, talking about community, which is really important to me, and is also a DNA of what we do. Represented through economically regenerative impact. We're not just doing token CSR for the sake of it. It's really baked into our ethos. We are contributing the development of long term industry infrastructure through retail, but also an industry resource. We're focused on developing that next generation of creative talent. Speaking a little bit about more of our following, we had a prediction when we first launched, and that has largely come true.
Nisha Kanabar:
Our customers and following come from about 190 different countries worldwide, and we ship from about, as of now, about 14 different African countries. Hopefully we'll also tackle all that at some point. Our customer is base is really authentically cosmopolitan. Authentically global, predominantly about 30 or so percent comes from the US, 30 or so percent comes from the continent. Nigeria, South Africa and Kenya are our biggest markets there. Then we have Europe as our secondary market. We have customers in Japan, Australia, Singapore, really global and 70% female.
Fadel Jaoui:
Okay. What I noticed while you were describing the company is a recurrent word of storytelling, narrative, et cetera. I think that's really crucial because you know the saying, "If you don't tell your own story, somebody will tell it for you." It's important that sources from Africa are telling that story, like your platform and so on. I think that's absolutely essential. If I get it right, I went to the platform and it looks to me like a hybrid of a fashion magazine and e-commerce platform. Would that be a fair comparison?
Nisha Kanabar:
Absolutely, absolutely. For me, I don't think you can have one without the other, especially when you're shopping African fashion. Like I mentioned, there's an education component. There's a provenance component that you'd be missing if you had a solely multi-brand e-commerce platform without the content element in it. We tried to make sure we have a balance of fashion edits and style edits with culture and identity conversations, with market insights and business analyses.
Fadel Jaoui:
Another point I noticed, and also while looking at the platform, there's a plethora of designers and brands. What's your process of discovery and to curate designers?
Nisha Kanabar:
We work with three types of brands. We have the emerging vertical, or the emerging segment you can say. We have contemporary innovators, and contemporary innovators are those that push the boundaries of experimentation and innovate their own design codes, et cetera. Then we have a luxury and high fashion segment. We have a framework of eligibility that inducts designers into our community that we're launching through our CONNECT platform. But what we do is use that as a benchmark to see if the brand is at a point in their journey that is conducive to international distribution, and conducive to international recognition. Just simple things like imagery, simple things if it's not seasonal collections at least they're having some sort of cadence that represents them as a brand. Then things like African origin, of course. It's very important to make sure that brand distinctly represents it's origins in that sense. It has accolades, perhaps. Maybe brands that have been through EFI initiatives, and international fashion showcase. These things are ones that tend to come up or trickle onto our radar.
Nisha Kanabar:
Brands that have received press, and also word of mouth is a huge element in that. We're looking at brands that really have the ability to scale. Then of course more intangibly, you can't create a framework for principles of curation, but a DNA of a brand must be forward thinking. It must be innovative, it must bring something new to a global conversation, because today anybody can access any brand. You have to need or want to choose your brand over another, or spend their dollars on your brand over another. So what sets you apart within that global space? It's not what you're great for Africa, it's you are great as a brand, independently, so you could stand on your own two feet and carry your conversations, and hold your voice and your own as a career.
Fadel Jaoui:
Yeah, it makes sense. Basically that means the brand needs to be scalable, and needs to be innovative. I think these are the main components so that they can be launched globally. Maybe I didn't look carefully enough but is there a men's section? I was trying to buy something for myself but didn't find anything. Is there a men's section yet? Or I'm not looking carefully enough?
Nisha Kanabar:
Not yet. But it is definitely something I want to introduce relatively soon. I think menswear, there's a big market for that. But also home. I think home and lifestyle, there's such an incredible, incredible home products, and lifestyle products of course, that are created but not getting the platform that they need. I would love to eventually go into that space. But right now, making sure I master what I have is really important, so that it can be replicated across the board.
Fadel Jaoui:
Sure. The home space, I think, would be particularly brilliant. Definitely, definitely brilliant. More than the men's section. Relatedly, since we're talking about brands and so on, and creativity. You're among the shapers of the luxury industry today, so the notion of luxury is dynamic and ever evolving. How would you define it today?
Nisha Kanabar:
I've been asked this question quite a few times, and my answer hasn't changed since. I think while luxury used to be synonymous with exclusivity and aspiration, and historic heritage. Today it resonates with the much younger consumers, through pillars of authenticity, through pillars of emotional connection, uniqueness, environmental consciousness. These are all really important factors that contribute to this greater vision of luxury. I think similarly in Africa, luxury is not about price point. It's about the scope and the depth of the story that a brand seeks to tell, through its craft. Be it a take on indigenous textiles or a re-interpretation of artisanal techniques, or a genuine understanding of their own identity and influences that they're bringing forth in their work, whether that's tangible or intangible. I think today, true luxury brands are ones that speak from this place of innovation and clear provenance, and identity, and of course, consider circularity when they are producing something for their customer.
Fadel Jaoui:
I think authenticity is particularly important today. We still don't have an internationally recognized luxury brand, such as Hermés and Prada or Dior. Why is that? Why not in Africa, and how is Industrie Africa contributing to make that happen?
Nisha Kanabar:
Every brand that you mentioned, they have one thing in common and that's that they're all from Europe. They're all multi-generational heritage businesses. I think luxury used to stem from this notion of history and heritage, as I have mentioned. Us as African haven't really had the privilege of documenting our stories, and innovating our heritage, our culture and influences, or our textiles, generation after generation. That's happened largely informally. This formal documentation is a fairly new thing for us. Luxury is very much in the eye of the beholder. It's the consumer that places value on you as a luxury product, and what Industrie Africa is doing is working on adapting that mainstream perception of the beholder through elevating the lens with which we tell our stories. I do think that the key to unlocking the expansion of luxury in Africa is really through preservation of craft, which is starting to die out if we don't bring our attention to it.
Nisha Kanabar:
But it's also this desire as an individual or creator of luxury to create something exceptional through the celebration of our rich resources and our skills, and stories. I will say that the thing about luxury is that it's not just exclusive to fashion. You're talking about locally made gems, and high value art, and high end beauty products that are derived from regional ingredients, and ethically sourced fine jewelry. All this stuff is also burgeoning on the continent, and can be labeled luxury.
Fadel Jaoui:
But I think the key is really scalability, because all these brands we talked about the European brands, they managed to scale globally. That needs an entire apparatus around, and infrastructure to be able to reach customers internationally. Maybe that's what's missing. All the supply chain and the distribution, et cetera. Or am I wrong?
Nisha Kanabar:
Sure, no I think that's definitely an element of it. But before being able to master international markets, it's important to master your own. These Hermés and Prada and Dior didn't turn international over night. They started with their unique neighborhoods and their unique communities before expanding to that level. I think it's important for not only... It's a responsibility of the consumer to respect that luxury process and buy into that story. But also, our government to improve manufacturing. There's a whole ecosystem and infrastructure that's needed to be able to take luxury to the place where we want it to be, that goes beyond just being able to distribute internationally, that we have to fix the issue at home before getting to the stage like that.
Fadel Jaoui:
It makes sense. So far we talked about the company, and we talked about the industry. Now let's talk a bit more about you and your role in the company. What does a typical work day of a fashion startup CEO like you look like?
Nisha Kanabar:
At present, it's totally un-glamorous 10-hour days behind my desk. I don't have that interaction because we are 100% natively digital. Our editor is based out of New York, our e-commerce manager out of Kenya, our fashion writer out of South Africa, content coordinator out of Nigeria. Freelance writers, developers, really all over the world. It's not your typical hustle and bustle, if you will, that a lot of startup founders find themselves in the throes of. My day kicks off with sales and team meetings, and then the end of the day often tends to be the busiest with international time zones kicking in, that many of team members reside in. I personally have my hands dipped in all sorts of the operational workflow. From the macro to the micro, in a single day it could oscillate between logistics troubleshooting, customer service to planning creative content, to onboarding fresh talent. It's super operational because right now we're short staffed. It's very much all hands on deck at the moment.
Fadel Jaoui:
So it's not all glamor like we would see in fashion magazines.
Nisha Kanabar:
Oh, no. Absolutely not. Working on the continent is hard work, but it's incredibly rewarding work so I guess there's a trade off.
Fadel Jaoui:
I can imagine. That compensates for sure. Since we're talking about the inner workings of the company, there are two key foundations of any company in general. It's the financing part and the human capital part. More specifically, let's talk about the gender gap in startup funding. As of 2019, a mere 13% of total venture capital in Africa was allocated to female founded startups. That's a ridiculously low number. Did you feel it has been more difficult to be a female entrepreneur, in particular when it comes to raising funds?
Nisha Kanabar:
In all transparency, it's something I've been thinking about a great deal. I guess I'm an anomaly because I'm privileged enough to be a company that is self funded, or IA is at least. There's, of course, no way this would have been able to come to life without that self bet, if you will. Investors do historically prefer safer bets. You have agri-processing, especially on the continent. New money is now looking for fintech, logistics is getting a huge deal of attention. Creative businesses are not attractive to investors. I think that's across the board, but especially in a high risk market. Or like the one we are dealing with on the continent. Fashion businesses generally cannot demonstrate scalability. It's all a new, path breaking environment, so investors who appreciate long term investments are much harder to find, because people tend to have unmatchable expectations when it comes to return. I will say the institutions with the most capital on the continent are usually tel-cos, luxury F&B banks, and that's why you'll see them as sponsors for all these fashion events.
Nisha Kanabar:
But generally it's challenging to be a female entrepreneur, I think, in a patriarchal society, and African society especially.
Fadel Jaoui:
That's for sure. So far you said it's been self funded, but you have plans for fundraising rounds in the future, I suppose?
Nisha Kanabar:
Yes. There's a certain place that I want to get the business at before I'm ready for that kind of step. Probably by the end of the year we’ll start to think about a raise.
Fadel Jaoui:
The other side that I mentioned is human capital. A nontrivial task for entrepreneurs, especially when the company is expanding like yours and requiring top execs, is choosing the right person for the right position. What do you typically look for when hiring new people?
Nisha Kanabar:
As a first time founder I will say I've learned this the hard way. I've been a professional, as we've been through, and HR is such an important part. Really the building blocks of your company and that's something you don't realize the extent of until you're in it. But I think for us in particular it's twice as complicated because we are natively digital, as I've mentioned, and so we need people with a very digital mindset. It's not enough to have that skillset of whatever the role requires, you need somebody who thinks digitally, and who is self motivated, who's ambitious and self aware because you don't have that office environment that you would otherwise have, and therefore you can't micro manage. Or at least it's very difficult to do so. I think something we share with all startup environments is that it's really all hands on deck. I'm starting to realize that we are looking for what they call T shaped skills. A deep expertise in a single area, but then a wide breadth of skills and the ability to be successful in other areas as well, transferrable skills.
Nisha Kanabar:
That's predominantly how we look for our talent.
Fadel Jaoui:
I assume your team is scattered globally, but yet connected. Then you have to orchestrate all that. I like what you're saying about the T shaped skillset, because for a while people were pushed towards specialization. But increasingly we're back a bit to being generalists, and favoring generalists, and having some sort of hybrid between the two. It's an interesting trend that we observe in theory, because you have all these management theorists starting to talk about it again. But it's interesting to see that it's also happening in practice, like in your company. A different angle I would like to talk to you more about, because I think it matters a lot to your company. In economic and business circles, the buzzword of the day is sustainability. It's sustainability this, sustainability that. But from what I understand, at your company it's something you do take seriously. How are you promoting sustainable fashion at Industrie Africa?
Nisha Kanabar:
By nature of what we do, we are a sustainable business. It's not a green-washed word for us. In addition to it being a part of our, for a lack of a better word, DNA, we've also developed a sustainability framework that acknowledges and recognizes our designers for meeting a set criteria with a particular badge. If you go to the website you even can filter by sustainability, and a lot of people do like to do that. We also the ability to filter by sustainable fabrics, for example, as well. What is interesting to note is that African designers often inherently can be dubbed sustainable because they adopt sustainability practices that are led by their current production environments, or their lack of resources. It's just something that I've noticed since coming into this industry, that it's very much woven into the fabric of these designers' ethos.
Fadel Jaoui:
It's interesting because it's almost like it's sustainability by constraint. Is that what you're trying to say?
Nisha Kanabar:
In a way, yes. I don't think that's a bad thing. I think what it really means is slow fashion. It's the opposite of churning out a multitude of garments in a faceless factory. You have employees that have certain skills that you're developing and cultivating, and working with. You're giving a community of people jobs. You're developing generations of craftsmanship. There's a whole deeper meaning to what they're doing and yes, perhaps that's more natural but that is a part of our identity as this African fashion environment.
Fadel Jaoui:
Somehow it's linked back to your definition of luxury because I guess now luxury means also sustainability, and it means slower fashion, not fast fashion anymore. Because even the big brands, and I don't want to mention the names out of respect, moved on to fast fashion. Whereas it's almost like we're going back to former definitions of luxury where it was about craftsmanship, as you say, and detail and authenticity. I don't think we would be able to disentangle sustainability from luxury and quality anymore going forward.
Nisha Kanabar:
Right, I think it has to be inherently baked into any new brand's model in general.
Fadel Jaoui:
Yeah, be sustainable or die, basically. That's the new motto.
Nisha Kanabar:
You don't have to tick boxes, but just care about what you're doing, who you're doing it with, why you're doing it. That's really all it takes.
Fadel Jaoui:
Yeah, that's for sure. We can't avoid talking about what became the new normal, the global pandemic. How has COVID-19 impacted the business over the past year, and your industry more generally?
Nisha Kanabar:
We launched in the middle of the pandemic so we've yet to see what normal looks like, and what totally normal looks like. Our business, luckily, it was in the making for about a year but it's mostly designed on these forward thinking, future oriented principles, given our mission, which is diversity oriented. Or very sustainability oriented. It's very community oriented. Our product also reflects that. Even the way that we work digitally is reflective of what we're experiencing right now. It was never, of course, the plan but it happened to align in a really organic. I think what you're seeing in general in fashion is digital has taken center stage, sorry accelerated digitization has taken center stage. Even in retail you have to be able to translate these offline experiences online, and find new ways to do that. Whether that's through virtual reality, whether that's through innovative sizing methods. There's a whole universe that's opened up.
Nisha Kanabar:
But I think when you think of the consumer people shop more consciously. People have begun to shop more consciously. Whatever that means to them, and align their luxury purchase decisions with their values. Again, our values very much relate and resonate with that customer because there's a certain element of transparency in how to navigate our website, a certain level of storytelling. That just happens, that was a very natural fit for us. I think all businesses, and especially fashion business in today's age are expected to be accountable for their choices and their decisions. Whether that's their team and the diversity in their team, and the diverse perspectives in their team, their executive team, even, all the way to their supply chain. I think that accountability has become increasingly important.
Fadel Jaoui:
But can you ever remove the physical experience from fashion? I don't think so, so how are you combining the two? What are your plans from that standpoint?
Nisha Kanabar:
That is a very good question. I don't believe that you can entirely remove the physical. I do think that you can bring it as close as possible to that tactility, and that's what we try to do by making sure the customer knows how something was made, who it was made by, the process with which it was made, whether it's sustainable or not, the sizing. We're trying to be as transparent as possible in that experience. But it will never replace the ability to touch those fabrics. I think that's a really good question, and I think that's why we will be going into an offline space through popups, through partnerships, and other means. But as of now, especially given the pandemic, this is the most accessible, the most innovative, the closest that one can access this market, short of being able to touch and feel the product.
Fadel Jaoui:
Yeah, makes sense. On a more optimistic note, what's next for Industrie Africa and what's your vision for Africa's fashion more broadly?
Nisha Kanabar:
Sure. We've dipped our toes with our launch and we've seen an incredible response, so I think it's about building a more robust ecosystem, and building a more robust infrastructure when it comes to the community. Something we're launching very soon is the CONNECT platform, which I think I dropped earlier. Which is basically a reboot of our designer index and will serve as a resource for the landscape of African fashion. Again, for the global community but also the regional one. I feel like that is still something that's missing. It will be a much, much more evolved version of what we were doing before. We want to grow it to be a real community, and develop it further to offer African and regional creatives in general access to educational resources, things that are tough at the moment. To develop the next generation we really want to be able to bring that forward. For the industry in general, I suppose it's about emancipation. For so long we've relied on the, I would say, Western infrastructure, and tried to tailor ourselves to that.
Nisha Kanabar:
I think this increased creative and intellectual pan-Africanism that we've been seeing is a testament to a greater sense of self reliance. There's an increased support for shopping local. I think there will continue to be increased support for shopping local. I'm also confident that through increased manufacturing policies, and through intra Africa infrastructures such as the free trade agreement, and regional collaboration, I think we will achieve what we want to in that sense.
Fadel Jaoui:
I like the word emancipation. I think it's the perfect word. Not only for fashion but also for other sectors. The AfCFTA that you mentioned, the continental free trade agreement as well is part of being independent and build our own regional trade agreement. I guess that's really the way forward on all levels. I have two final questions for you. The first one is, is there a particular book that influenced your way of managing and leading, or even your life philosophy that you would recommend to us?
Nisha Kanabar:
I have to say I'm still searching for that book that really speaks to me in my unique situation, with my unique skills that can help me scale this company digitally, which is such a new thing. Books usually take two years to get into print, and by then the infrastructure or the rules maybe have already changed. In the meantime my learning's really come from speaking to experts, advisors, listening to live panel, podcasts. Maybe even using Clubhouse, which is this strange way of learning. That's the answer that I can give you.
Fadel Jaoui:
You know what, I think you should be the one writing that book. I'll be expecting that. I'll be expecting that in the next few years. Last but not least, what would you tell young people as they jump into similar entrepreneurial journeys in Africa, and what does it take to be truly successful in your view?
Nisha Kanabar:
I think success is an ongoing journey and how you really define it. I will say that we are on our journey to success. There's a huge mission that we have that can't be defined in a single six months or a year. But my biggest advice to budding entrepreneurs is you have to learn the ropes to know how to break the rules. For me, I think learning is so democratic today. You have access to it. I know education is a problem on the continent. I very much accept that, I acknowledge it, I think it's a ubiquitous understanding. But there's no excuses when it comes to online classes, to podcasts, to apps, to all sorts of abilities. Access to people, even. Those walls are breaking down. We don't have any excuses anymore. Most of us, again, don't grow up with that access to formal education within our passions, or that might fuel our passions. For example, fashion. There was no reason for me to go into that, growing up in Dar es Salaam Tanzania. But even the connections that one might acquire through nepotism, that automatically might give us an in at our dream jobs.
Nisha Kanabar:
That's not something that is that common on the continent either. My advice would be get as much cookie cutter experience in your field and peripheral fields. Get as much experience as you can, at the youngest age possible. Be hungry for learning and experience. That will help you understand what you're looking for when you're trying to deconstruct the problems that you want to solve. That would be my greatest advice.
Fadel Jaoui:
Yep, that's great insight. Nisha, you're passionate, sharp and inspiring so thank you for being with us today.
Nisha Kanabar:
Thank you so much for having me. It's been a pleasure.
Fadel Jaoui:
And to the audience listening, I strongly encourage you to discover African fashion in all its diversity on industrieafrica.com, that's in one word, and Industrie with French spelling. Thanks for listening and until next time.
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